What does Terry Jones think when he announces that he will burn Islam's Holy Book 'Quran' ??
Does he think that we as Muslims we will be happy as our Holy Book is treated like that !!??
How does he say "he welcomes Muslims" yet insists that their religion is evil and should be destroyed !!??
Muslims are grumpy and Jones himself is not Robin Williams !!??
My own explanation to Jones' case is that he wants to be famous , what better way to be in the international headlines not only the local ones except by provoking Muslims around the world.
Watch Terry Jones speaking to CNN's The list. I could not post her because seriously the man is sick and provoking.
In every religion you will find people like Jones exactly.
Burning books did not stop ideas or faiths or sciences to continue and you can ask Galileo and Averroes.
Burning books did not stop ideas or faiths or sciences to continue and you can ask Galileo and Averroes.
ReplyDeleteIn fact, it often did, but the comparison is same nonsensual as the CNN's moderator comparison to burn his house down.
Anyone can burn their books as much as they want, being it either Koran or the Origin of Species, because they own them!
Terry Jones got it right on "How would you feel if a Muslim burned the Bible?":
I would not like it, but it's their right. We are living in America
Difference between like and right is a thing which Muslims cannot get while burning Israeli, Danish or American flags, but protesting against burning of Koran ... as those flags have no value for others right
Just like 'Muslim' wacko preachers who appear on fanatic religious TV shows in the Middle East, Terry Jones is a 'Christian' wacko preacher who should be ignored and added to the garbage heap of nutcases.
ReplyDeleteShame on CNN for giving these people the time of day to express their twisted views.
Yeah, he wants attention. Historically, book-burning originates from a time when the printing press was a novelty and books were rare. It was a powerful and effective way of destroying information. Nowadays you can go to a used book shop for a few copies of whatever text offends you and make a bonfire to show on YouTube. No harm done. As long as the books he burns belong to him, I have no problem with it. Holy books, political manifestos, scientific treatises, Mohamed cartoons, whatever. Go for it. Bring marshmallows.
ReplyDeleteburning a Harry Potter book... 50 spectators proceeded to burn the Book of Mormon, a non-King James edition of the Bible, and even the Dan Aykroyd movie Coneheads... 160 tons of obscene literature... copies of The Da Vinci Code... due to the high cost of the book, protesters likely only burned three copies... In Ceccano, Italy, only one copy of the book was burned, even as protesters hurled tomatoes at the burners... the most famous burning of all time occurred at the Royal Library at Alexandria, Egypt...
ReplyDeleteJason, what this preacher wants to do isnt part of being free, its spreading hate and it should be deemed a crime. Hes not saying Im going to burn my copy of the holy book of another faith, he is asking ppl to participate. How could this man be allowed to continue to function as a religious figure?!! Those muslim teachers and preachers deemed to be spreading hateful words against followers of other religions are usually not tolerated any more and are usually taken off their posts, why isnt the same done to this man?
ReplyDelete@Anonymous 1:06 AM,
ReplyDeleteYou are earnest and polite, and I understand how you feel about this. This makes me sad, because there is no compromise possible. The conflict will exist forever, or one side concedes. Zeinobia, who I know from experience is admirably tolerant, said herself she was provoked, so there is really no hope. The best I can do is give my heartfelt response to your statement, with the understanding that I am only explaining, not trying to convince you, nor trying to insult you.
Let me answer each part:
"Jason, what this preacher wants to do isnt part of being free, its spreading hate and it should be deemed a crime."
His opinion is that Islam is hateful. He has a right to be wrong about that. Even if he is spreading hate, in his jurisdiction there is no law against that. And it should not be deemed a crime: The freedom to offend is the core, the foundation, the backbone of freedom of expression. There is no freedom of expression without the freedom to offend.
"Hes not saying Im going to burn my copy of the holy book of another faith, he is asking ppl to participate."
He has freedom of association and can invite who he wants. They can accept or decline.
"How could this man be allowed to continue to function as a religious figure?!!"
The US government is prohibited by the Constitution from accrediting, certifying or licensing clergymen. Parishioners who find Pastor Terry Jones unpleasant will not attend his sermons.
"Those muslim teachers and preachers deemed to be spreading hateful words against followers of other religions are usually not tolerated any more and are usually taken off their posts, why isnt the same done to this man?"
There are two parts to the answer.
(1) Tolerance for spreading hate against infidels varies from country to country in the Muslim world. On Memri TV I have seen shockingly hateful sermons from Saudi and Iranian imams. And Jordanian and Palestinian. And Egyptian too: Cleric Hussam Fawzi Jabar: Hitler Was Right to Do What He Did to the Jews. But if hateful imams occasionally get fired it's because MENA countries have a legal mechanism. The American first amendment prohibits that absolutely: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..."
(2) But even if a law existed to shut him up, it should not be done. The West is under no obligation to respect Islam (or any other institution) in return for being respected. Respect is not a bulk commodity to be divided into equal quantities and shared. Respect must be earned. Not everyone deserves the same respect.
@Jason: thank you for your response. I think its understood that we are all here to discuss and exchange ideas not forcing someone to change his/her opinion. Thanks for your opening statement though.
ReplyDeleteI think this issue takes us back to a more basic question, is there such a thing as complete freedom? Is it freedom of speech when my words spread hate? I understand your logic if what he was saying is that Islam is not an accepted religion, since as a Christian he does not acknowledge it but to call it evil what does that make of its followers? and what would be the result of the words of a man who is supposed to be a model to those who follow his church, on those following him? How would these words impact the way they view a segment of their own society?
Hilter, started by words too and then these words turned into actions.
Also, its not true that all is allowed in the US. Prohibitions (doesnt have to be legal ones) on what would be considered as anti-simitic have been applied in the West for years now, so, why the different treatment? Can a preacher show on US networks and say the same about Judaism? Just few days ago just bec director Oliver Stone dared to express a different point of view he was forced to apologize, and hes not the first one.
In short, I dnt think that freedom of speech like any freedom is just absolute. Any personal freedom has its limitations and when someone abuses his/her freedom of speech to encourage members of the society against a particular segment of their own society, this is a hate crime. The fact that there are no legal safeguards against such abuse reveals a defect. I didnt say all our preachers are angels, I said we have several examples of how they are dealt with and If the US doesnt have a mechanism to deal with hateful preachers its about time it does.
Also, personally I never see any point in they type of talk that is meant to insult the believes of others. It simply leeds to nothing, except hatred.
"Respect must be earned,Not eveyrone deserves the same respect"!!!! Im not sure if I got you correct here but who is to decide who deserves respect and who doesnt?! Was there a particular time when Americans suddenly decided dark-skinned ppl deserve respect or have earned it now? when was that honor bestowed on Jews? asians? and is there a particular thing we as Muslims should do to get that honor? What kind of mentality is that? Does that mean its alright for us in Egypt to decide that Americans havent earned our respect so its alright to disrespect them? their believes? their history? their culture? What kind of awful logic is that?!! All humans deserve respect, which God they choose to worship should never be a factor in how much you respect them.
Im sure u know that as Muslims we are forbidden from bad-mouthing others esp the ppl of the book and as for supporting Hitler or praying against Christians and Jews, several notable scholars have talked about how this is forbidden. According to your American logic, those say so are actually exercising their freedom of speech and where will that take us in a multi-faith society?
As for the use of the word infidel, well arent we muslims considered infidels to Jews and Christians, so why is it hateful when we use the proper terms, esp if in the context of a religious sermon/prog ect?
@Anonymous 3:27 AM, Your position is a reasonable one in many, perhaps most cultures. And you expressed it well.
ReplyDelete"is there such a thing as complete freedom? Is it freedom of speech when my words spread hate?" It's true free speech isn't absolute. The threshold for what's permissible in America is the highest in the world, higher than in Germany (where you can't fly a Nazi flag) or in England (where libel suits are popular) and vastly higher than in MENA countries. The canonical example of the upper limit in American law is that you can't shout "fire" in a crowded theater, because the harm is imminent and reasonably expected. Insults to Islam, Muslims, Quran, blacks, Jews, whites and Christians are legally fine.
"Also, its not true that all is allowed in the US. Prohibitions (doesnt have to be legal ones) on what would be considered as anti-simitic have been applied in the West for years now, so, why the different treatment? Can a preacher show on US networks and say the same about Judaism? Just few days ago just bec director Oliver Stone dared to express a different point of view he was forced to apologize, and hes not the first one." It makes all the difference in the world whether the prohibitions are legal ones. It's the only thing that matters. Oliver Stone was not charged, arrested, tried or jailed. The rarity of Jew hatred on American networks is due to network policy and public opinion, not law. That's as it should be.
""who is to decide who deserves respect and who doesnt?!" Each individual.
"is there a particular thing we as Muslims should do to get that honor?" Stop blaming Americans and Israelis for your problems. For me as for most Americans that will earn you some respect. Also, don't do happy-dances when Muslims blow up twin towers.
"Does that mean its alright for us in Egypt to decide that Americans havent earned our respect so its alright to disrespect them? their believes? their history? their culture?" Yes, absolutely. Many of you do it anyway. We don't care.
"All humans deserve respect" Humans who are kind, industrious, studious, and inventive for example may deserve more respect than humans who are indolent, blame-shifting, and self-detonating. Your categories may differ. Who to respect should be up to the individual. My categories are only examples, and not a characterization of MENA residents.
"As for the use of the word infidel, well arent we muslims considered infidels to Jews and Christians, so why is it hateful when we use the proper terms, esp if in the context of a religious sermon/prog ect?" I don't know any Christians or Jews who call anyone infidels, but I don't mind anyone using the word infidel if they want. I totally would wear a tee-shirt that says كافر . In the interest of full disclosure, I should say that Muslim claims of respect for "people of the book" whether true or not don't matter to me because I am an atheist, which for American math PhDs is not unusual.