So Lacoste is angry that Norwegian terrorist Anders Behring Breivik was spotted while wearing nice red Lacoste sweater ,
well I wonder what Lacoste is going to say about its brand image when it sees a dictator wearing it.
By the way according to leaks the favorite brand for the Tora prison country club is Ralph Lauren.
 |
| Breivik in Lacoste "Reuters" |
 |
| Mubarak in Lacoste "Reuters" |
I'm wearing LaCoste most of the time! LOL
ReplyDeleteGhaddaff promised that if he is caught alive he will design all the uniforms used in prisons around the world including Tora.
ReplyDeleteCould hold a dictators fashion show, complete with a cleric in Armani robes and Versace turban. Assad I would guess favours Hugo Boss for the up & coming, go-ahead younger generation of tyrants. Karl Lagerfield could supply a bracing new eau de cologne named "Crackdown!"
ReplyDeleteHello Zeinobia,
ReplyDeleteI'm H, I'm from Argentina. I'm jewish. We refer to arabs as our semite cousins so hi there cousin :).
I've been to your wonderful country twice, in 1987 and 1996. I've been to Israel many times as well, I have a lot of family there.
I also have a blog (in Spanish) where I support the arab spring because I want for all the peoples of the world -arabs included of course- the same level of peace, freedom, rule of law and development I enjoy in Argentina and my family enjoys in Israel.
I do not wish to enter into a long argument about palestinians, wars, etc. I mean, I can, I know quite a lot about Middle East History and Present and we can chat if you want, but that's not what I came here for.
I feel the arab reaction against Israel and the jews originates in a really distorted image that you have on us, thanks to the nazi propaganda you receive (like this shit) and the fact "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion", which is a forgery, a fraud, a damned lie (it was invented by the russian police in the XIX century to blame the jews), is very much present in your media.
What do you think?
Regards and shukran,
H
I feel sympathy for this guy from Argentine... he lives in his own distorted world .
ReplyDeleteAs for Mubarak, This is the irony of destiny: even the king of France was wearing luxury cloths when he was executed :)
I've been meditating on the look on this tyrant's face. What was he thinking of ? only now i noticed the nice looking lacoste ... I can stop meditating ... He is probably thinking whether it looks good on camera. And it really does!
ReplyDeleteGaddafi new prison fashion line will be marketed under the name of 'ZENGA-ZENGA'.
ReplyDeleteThanks for ur sympathy anonymous. But even though we had dictatorships up to 1983, we live in an Open Society, where we hear everybody's bells (even palestinians and egypcians). By bells I mean points of view, of course. You don't live under a democracy, nor you have free press or freedom of speech, so it's more likely it's you who have a distorted view of the world.
ReplyDeleteBest regards,
H
@H, would you give a link to your blog in Spanish? Zeinobia probably doesn't see a problem with the Nazi-style caricatures of Jews that characterize Arab cartoons. Recently she posted with approval a cartoon with a racist depiction of an Israeli soldier. In her defense, she is a product of her culture just like everyone. And Arab cartoons don't limit their bigotry to Jews. Black Africans are depicted with frank racism too.
ReplyDeleteDear Mr H from Argentine,
ReplyDeleteYou brought the story of the "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion" , just tell us how is this connected to anything in the Arab spring.
As for Democracy: you may have something you can call such, but it is all about capitalism accompanied by corruption and consumerism. You eat what they tell you to eat , you drink what they tell you to drink, you talk what they push into your mouth, the difference from what we had is that you don't know that , but we did !!!
Brain wash in dictatorships is a low quality art, you need only force. but once the dictator is gone, you are free.
But in the so called "democratic" world, from the US till Israel :) the brain wash is delicate, you have no hope to get rid of it because you are not aware that it even exists.
Having that said, I wish you a real liberation and happiness .
Jason, I don't think I agree with the "product of her culture" as a justification, I don't know, we're in a connected world now, and books are at everybodies fingertips and she can write to israeli youths to find out how they really are (like that eg. Blogger who was jailed)... I mean: is she willing to read some undeformed history and accept, for example, that the arab leader in Palestine back in the 30's and 40's, Haj amin al Husseini, was a full fledged nazi, who spent 2nd world war with Adolph Hitler himself?
ReplyDeleteAnyway my blog is apuntes-urbanos.blogspot.com, and my last post was critizing Israel for not apologizing to Egypt and Turkey, thus giving an excuse to freeze relations.
Anonymous:
ReplyDeleteprotocols: did you see the link I included in my first message?
Capitalism and western democracy: I'm not getting into that discussion. In an open society like Argentina and Israel you can call yourself a marxist openly, run freely for elections, etc. If you take that for granted, good for you, but that freedom costed us decades of struggle.
Ah, in Argentina I can go and buy a book about Chomsky any day I want. Can u buy anything u want in closed societies? Please, let's not talk nonsense to justify dictatorships who brainwash besides being brutal.
ReplyDeleteHere's something ur media doesn' want u to know: Israeli youth organizing Rally for love at the Egyptian Embassy in Tel Aviv: https://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=164718263610229
You have been set free! Enjoy. :)
Oh yeah. lets praise the free society of Argentina, where you can say youre a marxist, but when you act like one and wanna build another society fascist army officers, in the spirit of all the german nazis Argentina gave a good home, will establish a dictatorship.
ReplyDeleteAnd about the old hasbarian storys about Husseini, which should make the Palestinians look like as evil as our german nazis: Ever mentioned the thousands of Palestinians who fought agints Germany on the side of the Brits? Oh, hell no, that doesn't fit in the great picture where Pali=Nazi. People like you need this stories of "the Palestinians" as willing servants of Germany as as a legimitation to opress them 60 years later. Once a alleged helper of Shoa, always one. But that counts only for Arabs, while Israel nowadays has best relationships with german amd austrian islamophobic rightwingers, the ones that inspired that scumbag Breivik in Norway.
ReplyDeleteDear Mr H from Argentine,
ReplyDeleteI think you didn't understand my message . It is Ok , it takes time to understand the brain wash people live in anywhere in the world. It is true , in argentine , you can do this , and you can do that . But, do you really want this , and this "want" was it truly your decision, and not a brain wash by some delicate art of brain wash.
I'll give you an example:
Most of the jews in Israel think that the whole world hates them, they think that they are being chased every where , they think that muslims hate them, they think that christians hate them, they think that others think that jews are the reason of all trouble. This is the brain wash, how did they get there ? a sophisticated brain wash system , but for no cause, just to justify the status of no peace.
And why to justify the status of no peace, just because those who have the privilege , so that they can continue with it, not wanting to give it up.
So that settlers can get land for free, citizens can live in settlements and get tax reductions, lands, rights confiscated , people exiled, prisoned, put behind walls of ghettos .
Idealogy and Money , the best catalizators for brain wash . It is not dictatorship, but it is not freedom !
So to summarize: The truth can liberate you. Seek it !
Anonymous,
ReplyDeleteYou speak of Israel as monolitic ("most of the jews in Israel..."). Respectfully, you don't know very much what you are talking about, habibi. It's a very diverse country. Gay parades in Tel Aviv, orthodox jews in Jerusalen, christian arabs in the north, beduins in the south. I suggest you do an effort to know it better before drawing conclusions.
What I'm trying to tell you is that open societies like Israel, with arab TV channels and newspapers, arab congressmen in the Israeli congress, etc, israeli jews that advocate for palestinean rights, is much closer to the ideal than a closed society.
Show me something similar to that in closed and oppressed societies like Egypt, where copt christian churches are being burn down.
Maikel Nabil Sanad, the egyptian blogger that did a little research and discovered he had been lied all his life about Israel was put to jail.
"From a young age I read a lot about the Israeli-Arab conflict. I understood the Arab media hid facts that support Israel. I tried to contact Israeli activists and started asking them questions, such as, 'Is it true that Israel is a militaristic state?' or, 'Is it true that Israel wants to expand and reach the Nile? That's how I learned. I understood a lot about the state, society and its laws. Many Arabs living in Israel told me how they are really treated and how much they prefer living in Israel above any Arab state. I also read about Israeli pacifist organizations."
Jail a blogger: that's real oppression. Get rid of that, then we can talk about maximizing the number of voices so the most powerful/wealthy one do not monopolize our minds.
H
"Oh yeah. lets praise the free society of Argentina, where you can say youre a marxist, but when you act like one and wanna build another society fascist army officers, in the spirit of all the german nazis Argentina gave a good home, will establish a dictatorship. "
ReplyDeleteIn Argentina, Marxist parties exist and run for election, but nobody votes them. Last election they got less than 3% of votes.
Maybe you are referring to the dictatorships which ended in 1983. As I said, it costed us a lot to have this god blessed open and democratic society. Those dictatorships were our Mubarak's. I hope one day you have at least 10% of the democracy we enjoy. We live in peace, jews and arabs (christian and muslim) and we don't set churches on fire like egipcians do with copts'.
Peace, man.
"Haj-Hamin al Husseini": I didn't say it justifies anything 60 years later, I'm just setting the record straight. I'm glad you recognize the uncle of Arafat, leader of Palestinian Arabs who massacred all the non-extremist arab families (like the Nusseibi), was a nazi and a friend of Hitler. At least it's a starting point.
ReplyDeleteDear Mr H from Argentine,
ReplyDeleteI know of the diversity of israel more than you: You presented it horizontally: all groups living with the same rights .
but it is actually levels:
at the lowest : the arabs . ask yourself how many arab towns the state of israel did build since 1948 -> zero ?
then -> ethiopian jews
then -> jews from caucaz
then jews of arab country origins
then jews of russian descent
then jews of ashkenaz
i did position the orthodox jews on purpose , they are scattered everywhere.
What freedom Are you talking about ?
all of the jewish towns in galilee were build upon lands confiscated from the arab towns . and the arab towns became so dense that people fight for a parking place .
And then jews come from the center to live in those high standard living towns: get best villas for cheap prices . a closed club !
It is all about money and idealogy: brain wash .
as for telaviv -> it is considered another country within Israel, so yes the situation there is better.
Well, that's a social pyramid problem that happens everywhere (Argentina, USA, Europe and of course muslim countries included; see how arabs are doing in Iran).
ReplyDeleteDo you want to talk about confiscation? Let's talk about confiscation and compensation. 650,000 arab refugees chose or had to flee from Israel due to the wars. But what they don't tell you in Arab Media (talking about brainwashing) is that 820,000 jews had to flee from arab countries without the possibility to take their properties (a friends mother had to flee from Libya at night at risk of death taking only 20 usd and a suitcase). 600,000 of those 820,000 jewish refugees from arab lands were absorbed by Israel. Oh, you guys didn't know jews lived in refugee camps as well? But unlike Egypt with Gaza and Jordan with the West Bank, Israel absorbed them into its population.
So considering this population exchange of 820,000 jews vs 600,000 arab palestinians and that the average jew in arab lands had wealthier properties than the average arab palestinian in what became Israel, how much do you think arabs owe Israel in compensation?
I think a lot.
Open your minds, boys. They don't tell you everything.
Dear Mr H ,
ReplyDeleteFirst, I am glad that you see the pyramid of society: as long as it exists , there is no freedom or democracy . A man who work 400hrs a month just to rent a flat is as slave as the black slaves in the us in the 19th century .
Now for the other story, The Palestinians didn't choose the deportation or the exile, and THEY DIDN"T CHOOSE THE EXCHANGE . The jews that fled from the arab world SHOULD be given the right to ask for what is theirs from the arab countries ! Yes !
It is a shame that the arab jews were the ones who paid the price ! Everyone knows that they were the most peaceful of all citizens in the arab world ( and today in israel they are class b ) Right ! i assume that you are ashkenazi , and you are ok that others paid the price for the villas that your cousin is living in somewhere in some settlement !
right?
I wish you happiness ! but most of all to see the truth . and then you are free !
"the pyramid of society: as long as it exists , there is no freedom or democracy": that's your opinion, and I totally disagree with how you define democracy or freedom to say that, but really, I don't want to get into that discussion. I used to be marxist when I was young and stupid :) and you can read my blog entry "how to disarm a marxist argument in 4 manouvers" if you want my opinion :) <-it's in Spanish, try google translate.
ReplyDelete"THEY DIDN'T CHOOSE THE EXCHANGE":
Refugees hardly do, that's why they are called refugees. What they normally do is try to integrate into a receiving society: this happened between Greeks and Turks, between Polish and Germans, between Bangladesh' and Indians, with jews from arab lands in Israel and even palestinians in some cases like Chile, BIG ETCETERA. Who didn't? Palestinian arabs, political pawns, their descendants intentionally fed with fantasies about returning to the houses their grandparents left 60 years ago. Forget it. It's not going to happen. Now or ever. Maybe in a thousand years. Beer Sheva had 4000 inhabitants in 1947, it has 195,000 now. It's not the same city anymore. Get over it.
"The jews that fled from the arab world SHOULD be given the right to ask for what is theirs from the arab countries ! Yes !". Your proposal is quite naive. The countries they left 60 or 20 years ago do not exist anymore (as "arab palestine" doesn't exist either as I said above). I can't think of an israeli arab jew so stupid and suicidal to desire to live in a land full of ignorant jerks who believe israelis are not human beings but pigs (see my twitter discussion in @Apuntes_Urbanos).
Also, remember Israel did not force out all the arab palestininans in 1948 (that's how they are 20% of the population now), but arab armies did wipe out any jewish presence in the territories they conquered, some with antique jewish communities (like Old Jerusalem and Hebron).
Yes, I have azkenazi background and you don't see me putting bombs in Ukranian or Lituane cafes. My great-grandparents were given a refugee opportunity, they took it and prospered, and saved their lives and had children who developed in Latin America and have discussions over the internet instead of working :).
That said, I hope for a 2 state solution with Palestine living side by side with Israel, and not instead.
Shalom, Salaam,
H
@H, you write well in English and Spanish both.
ReplyDelete@Anonymous "I am glad that you see the pyramid of society: as long as it exists, there is no freedom or democracy." That's breathtakingly stupid. Every country has social strata.
"A man who work 400hrs a month just to rent a flat is as slave as the black slaves in the us in the 19th century." Um. Ok. Seriously though, you trivialize slavery and disrespect its victims with your sophomoric equivalence. By the way, north-African Muslims are the biggest slave-traders in the world today, casually buying and selling Christians and animists at $50 a head, like cattle.
Dear Mr H from Argentine,
ReplyDeleteWhen speaking of justice in the society pyramid it doesn't have to be Marxist solution. I didn't call for that . but my point was that as long as it exists don't go to arab countries and tell them we have democracy and they don't. because you don't ! Israel is not a democracy , it is the worst implementation of apartheid, from all angles.
And regarding the treatment the arab jews got from their european brothers: They were put in refugee camps, and were humiliated ! cleaned from lice using chemicals, thrown to hunger peripheral towns. And latter: babies of the jewish yemenees were taken from them when born for adoption by Ashkinaz elite families while telling them that the babies were born dead. A disaster !
Regarding how the Refugees co called "ran away" ! Read Benny Morris and you will understand: in the area of every 10 villages a massacre was done and so the people ran away . In some villages, people that didn't run were forced to leave.
Some villages were even evacuated after the end of everything, and after the villagers became citizens to the Israeli state.
Finally, the two states for two nations: This statement is the most ambiguous of all, that is why one wonders what is the true motive. ( right wing radical ? )
I believe that in the end there will be one state for all, where people will live in peace just like some parts of the world ! BUT those who have the privilege they will have to give it up , and just be like everyone else.
In order to fix the present and the future you have to admit and fix the past. It is easy to explain everything by saying: "Get over it" , but you say that just because "TODAY" Israel has the upper hand ! Peace can be made only between two equals ! those who have the lower hand will not give up till either equal or upper , and then they will dictate the solution ! The Arab spring is the begging of the journey towards that !
Wishing you lots of happiness in life, and liberation from the chains of the past !
Jason,
ReplyDeleteThanks! I speak portuguese too, and hebrew but not so fluently. Google translate's version is sometimes odd. If you need real (human) translation for some paragraph let me know!. You might be interested in reading what I wrote about Estados Unidos :)
H
Anonymous,
ReplyDeleteWe are running in circles here so this is my last message.
Benny Morris is israeli, and therefore a pig (that's what some egipcian arab springer told me), and as we all know pigs can't write.
Now seriously, read some Ephraim Karsh, he refuted Benny. And they are both zionists anyway. Telling the truth doesn't mean regrettal. I wish you a future egypt where academics can say the truth (as in Israel. That's democracy).
Most of arabs left without ever seeing an israeli soldiers. They left in waves, the first were the richer, who went to spend the near coming war to Cairo or Damascus. Of course the lies the arab media spred about the inexistent massacre of Der Yassin helped to create a panic exiling athmosphere.
Arabs started the war, and ethnically cleaned every bit of territory they conquered so get over it.
"Peace can be made only between two equals": this is absolutely false. Where do you get these ideas? Peace is made when the weaker side refuses to continue fighting. Like Japan and Germany in WW2. Arabs have a lot of "pride" and never want to loose so they will probably never stop sending their children to die. In my opinion, any mother that chooses to send a kid to die is a monster, but hey, that's me, a western brainwashed latino jew.
"arab jews were put in refugee camps": sorry, Both Hilton and Sheraton were full.
We did our best to dismantle those asap. TWENTY YEARS Egypt OCCUPIED Gaza and kept their "brothers" in refugee camps and never granted them any state whatsoever. And the Peace treaty almost collapsed when Begin insisted on Sadat to accept Gaza. If you are an arab, don't talk to me about refugee camps, with the exception of Jordan, you keep having your "palestinian brothers" without civil rights at all. Shame on you.
"I believe that in the end there will be one state for all": I don't want one state. I want a Jewish national democratic state, because history taught us that if we don't have sovereignity, russians, nazis and arabs kill us -jewish history in a nutshell-. We will never give up our sovereignity because we are not suicidal. PERIOD. That doesn't mean the Jewish national state can't be a democracy, all other national states are also democracies... with the exception of arab national states, of course.
(continued)
(continued)
ReplyDeleteMarxists (and another fundamentalists) and you share the same defect: a "maximalist" view. That's when you see only black or white. Either everything or nothing. If it's not the ideal of democracy that (you) have in mind, it's not a democracy at all. Etc. My advice: embrace gradualism. Learn to use the words "better", "more", "higher". For example:
-Argentina has a better education system than any arab country. We invest there 6,4% of our GDP. Is Argentina education "good" or "the best"? NO! Any scandinavian country is much better, and we have to learn from them.
-Israel is a democratic country, where every citizen elects his candidates, any party can run, vote is clean and secret, and if the ruling party looses the election, he gives up power voluntarily (Karl Popper's condition for democracy). Does it mean it's a perfect democracy? NO. But it's a much better democracy than any country surrounding Israel has.
-Israel has arab elected parlamentaries that express some ideas in Congress that any arab citizen wouldn't dare to say in his mother's house, for fear of the secret service. That's democracy.
-If the israelis decide to do something about the social injustices YOU don't have a say in that. You don't live there. It's their right to do so, because they elect the government. That's democracy.
-They also march in the streets. Do you know how many died or were killed? None. That's democracy.
I hope when you live in a democracy, you'll learn to appreciate it. My last words: Israel is not your enemy, illiteracy, corruption, lack of freedom and development: that's your enemy.
H
PS: Saudi Writers: The Secret to Israel's Success
Sorry, last one: For those starting to open their eyes, here's a recommended book: Myths & Facts Online. A Guide to the Arab-Israeli Conflict, by Mitchell G. Bard.
ReplyDeleteNow yes, salam aleikum.
Dear Mr H from Argentine,
ReplyDeleteSo you called Benny Morris a pig, i guess you'll do the same to other left wing jews who say the truth. You probably call jewish women that marry Arab men prostitutes . Such was the german propaganda against the jews in the 1930s.
And regarding the 48 refugees , you were not there... Don't bring Propaganda , please . Others were there and can tell you the truth ( read the recent tantoora village massacre)
You see, you represent the biggest obstacle in front of the peace, you called yourself a leftest, someone who wishes peace. But when looking on the ideas you present:
A peace between the weak and the strong, by having the weak to abandon the motivation to regain his equality.
A peace were minorities, refugees should "go ahead" and forgot what was taken from them by force.
A peace where you have two states: one jewish democratic state and one palestinian. You can be a muslim palestinian, a jewish palestinian a christian or a budhist one, but you can't be a muslim jewish. That is by definition a state of apartheid, a religious state just like Iran ( the Islamic republic) ( the orthodox jewish republic of israel :) )
So you act just like the labour party in Israel, you stand on the door and you don't go in , and you don't let anyone in.
It is easier to make peace with the right wind in Israel ( Begen&Sadat) than with the left wing.
BTW. the reason why i insist to answer you , is just to provide info for other Arabs that confront your propaganda , brain wash based ideas .
So thank you for your time,
Take care and god bless you.
I'm providing facts to counter your propaganda. You weren't there in 1948 either. BTW, this "So you called Benny Morris a pig" proves you have no sense of sarcasm whatsoever. I was mocking the morons that repeat in twitter the stupid phrases they were told by their preachers in mosques.
ReplyDeleteEpic thread. Enjoying immensely.
ReplyDelete@Anonymous "...you can't be a muslim jewish. That is by definition a state of apartheid..." No it isn't, it's just a logical tautology. You can't be a Buddhist Christian or a Hindu Muslim either. Really, you are seriously confused.
Dear MR H,
ReplyDeleteI was there in 48. My family was there ! I can tell you a lot about the way the deportation. There are villages that were even deported after the war. Go do your homework!
Jason, you missed my point. I said that defining a jewish state leads by definition to apartheid, because the definition is based on one ethnic/religion .
you can be a muslim american, a jewish american , a christian argentinian , a muslim egyptian , a budhist libyan, a christian tibetian: it works . But you cannot be a muslim jewish . See !
Go and check what is the country in the world that is the most difficult for an immigrant to get citizenship in it , and that is israel ( unless he is Jewish, then it is immediate). It is almost impossible, did you hear about the filipino workers and how the israeli state deported them and their child. The child is at the age of 4 and was born in israel.
A state should be a state for all of its citizens, That is why , Egypt HAS MORE HOPE THAN ISRAEL !!! Egypt is a country for all of its citizens ! all equal in the society for the love of the country and the individual !
Egypt has hope! Israel is going the wrong direction .
IF you want hope, raise your hand and follow the arab spring !
Only to untie the confusion and again, my last message:
ReplyDeleteIsraeli is a citizenship, not a religion. You can be an Israeli Muslim, and Israeli Jew, an Israeli Christian Greek orthodox, an Israeli Christian Russian orthodox, Israeli Christian Armenian orthodox, an Israeli Druze, even an Israeli Bahai (it's a monotheistic faith, they are being killed in Irán but enjoy the fruits of religious freedom in the State of Israel). This is a Bahai temple in Haifa, beautiful Zeinobia, isn't it?
And you can be white, black, yellow or whatever skin colour you are born. In Israel I met some black darfour muslim refugees learning hebrew, loving Israel, and in very good shape (I have a picture with my friend Idris). Yeah, those black human beings that the egyptian police kills.
If Propaganda means "Historical Fact that the arab side was never informed about in School" then yes, that's what I'm bringing here.
Somebody reading this, enough with the eternal arab victimization, please! take responsibility for at least one wrongdoing that you don't atribute to jews. You have to have done something bad in the past 100 years of conflict.
Regards,
H
Did I say villages were not deported? I mentioned 650,000 palestinian refugees, didn't I?. And yes, my jewish family and friends were kicked out of Tripoli and Beirut after the war, too, and they weren't even part of the conflict!. Sucks, doesn't it? Get over it and move on.
ReplyDelete"defining a jewish state leads by definition to apartheid, because the definition is based on one ethnic/religion", ok, so the ISLAMIC republic of Iran is an appartheid, the ARAB republic of Egypt is an appartheid, the ARAB republic of Siria is an appartheid...
APARTHEID!!! RACIST APARTHEID!!! <-I'm mocking illiterate antizionist mobs here. :)
"Go and check what is the country in the world that is the most difficult for an immigrant to get citizenship in it , and that is israel"
Bullshit. Another lie to a brainwashed palestinean child.
It has to be some Gulf Arab state (Saudi Arabia, UAE, Bahrain, Qatar, Oman, and Kuwait) which recognize citizenship only through the father and extend naturalization privileges only to well-connected Arab Muslims. Or Switzerland, where my aunt lived for decades, married to a swiss before getting her citizenship. Or, basically, any country whose citizenship is ruled by the concept of jus sanguinis, like Bulgaria, Belgium, China, Croatia, Estonia, Finland, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Iceland, long etcetera.
In Israel you get citizenship if you marry an israeli, nevermind of your religion. A lot of argentineans emigrated to Israel with their non-jewish spouses.
Man, grab a book, really, they don't bite. Don't read only what they tell you to read. Open your mind.
"I was there in 48. My family was there !" that is poetic. "I" was there in the russian pogroms, "I" was there in the Holocaust, where we lost all the family that remained in Europe. "I" was there in 1948, when the added armies of 7 arab countries invaded a recently born jewish state... and lost. But I'm not a refugee. I advise your family to switch from UNRWA to UNHCR, who actually helps Palestinians leave the refugee camps and settle in better conditions.
So do you blame your leaders and take responsability for anything that went wrong in the past 100 years? The massacre of Hebron in 1929? Having a nazi palestinean leader in the 20's-40's and nazi SS muslim troops?
Not accepting the partition in 1947? Invading in May 15th 1948? Not signing peace after loosing the war then or in any other war? Refusing the 2000 Barak offer (you'd have a country to immigrate by now)? Long Etc?
Be a grown up and accept some of your own (leader's) mistakes.
H
Dear Mr H from Argentine,
ReplyDeleteyou are back with propaganda again: You agree that Israel is not a democracy , from your answers , because you don't show me that my points are incorrect , you just show the excuse ! or the explanation why the injustice is a reality that have to be accepted. The worst regimes on earth couldn't do any better than what you are doing , and you have the Hutzpa to tell me to blame my leaders!
Some notes about citizenship:
1. no answer on the Filipino girl. Why was the 4 years old child born in israel deported? BY THE shit order of the court!!! (justice, God requested! and all he got from them was the cruelty of the hearts)
2. When marrying an israeli: if he/she is jewish then the process is not long. If he/she is an arab It is very very long . Again note the difference ! if the one asking for citizen ship is from the west bank , the citizenship request is REJECTED. Do you know how many families are split because of that in the Arab sector in Israel ! Can you imagine: Families DON'T have the right to live together in the 21st century democratic Israel !
3. A jewish person from anywhere around the globe when he gets to the airport he gets the citizenship Immediately ? why , is it because of his religion ?
4. If an Arab person, leaves Israel and for some reason he loses the citizen ship ( yes that is documented in the law of Israel, citizenship can be taken from someone that he and his grandparents were born there), he has no possibility to come back.
Why do you think that I was not there in 1948, that i didn't see how my house was destroyed. I tell you! the houses were destroyed on Christmas eve, just before the eyes of the people ( Merry Christmas )!
Our discussion was about whether Israel is a democracy or NOT. and meanwhile, you just gave justifications why Israel is doing non-democratic actions. Good for you , what can i say ... This just tells what you are !
Think peace, liberty , human rights and equality . And you'll be free ( I mean personally you: Mr H from Argentine)! not imprisoned in your own fears and brainwash!
It is not too late ! you can fix things ! the Arab spring calls upon you ! either be part of it or be crushed by it !
Ok, dude, whatever.
ReplyDeleteTake care,
H
New entry in my blog.
ReplyDeleteWe stand for Maikel Nabil Sanad (English)
Apoyamos a Maikel Nabil Salad (español)
Lacoste="Insatiable Crocodile of Radical Islam"
ReplyDeleteAsk Bibi....
Yes! Jews should be allowed to return to the arab lands which confiscated their property and kicked them out violently!
ReplyDeleteNot happening any time soon, apparently...
H
Israel was created by a UN resolution, full stop.
ReplyDeleteI don't know if the comment "Israel was created by a UN resolution, full stop." was for me, but it's wrong.
ReplyDeleteIsrael was created by the sweat and effort of generations and generations of jews, in Mandate Palestine and in the diaspora. The UN recognized an already existent country. This is what I mean:
In 1870 Mikve Israel is founded, an agricole school north of Yafo. 25 agricole villages are also built.
In 1890 Eliezer Ben Yehuda founds the Commité for the Hebrew Language.
In 1898 the Jewish Colonial Trust, then Anglo-Palestine Bank and currently Bank Leumi (National Bank).
In 1901, the Keren Kayemet Leisrael (Jewish National Fund), with the objective of aquiring land, dry swamps and bogs, urbanize and plant trees. Israel is the only country in the world to end XX century with more trees than when the century began. And is the one of the only countries founded on BOUGHT and PAID FOR lands (there was no violent capture of lands until Independence War, when 7 armies invaded the just born country).
More country building: 1902, hospital Sha'are Tzedek, in Jerusalén. 1903, Hebrew Teachers Association. 1906, Betzalel Art Academy. 1908, Hatzvi, first journal in the reborn biblical language, hebrew (another modern miracle). In 1909, Hashomer, the organization for the security of the jewish settlements. Same year, Tel Aviv, the first modern jewish city (heard palestinians are planning Rawabi, all my support!!).
Also 1909, the first kibutz, Degania, combining agriculture life with communitarian life. Several poets and young novelists set the basement for israeli literature (hey, Shai Agnon Literature Nobel Prize in 1966, not bad!). Workers parties formed ("Hapoel Hatzair" "Poalei Tzion").
In 1913 the Hebrew University of Jerusalem is started, inaugurated in 1925 with the National Library
During 1st World War, in 1918, the Jewish Legion is created, with voluntaries in the british army fighting against Ottoman Turks.
In 1919, Chaim Weizmann and Emir Feisal, head of the nationalistic arab movement, sign a collaboration agreement, later rejected by the arab nationalists (never missing an opportunity to miss an oportunity!).
In 1920 the Hagana, the clandestine (under british mandate) defense organization is founded, and also the Histadrut, the Workers Federation, strongly socialist oriented, where Ben Gurión would raise from. In 1921 the first moshav, Nahalal, is founded (kind of a kibutz but more cooperative than communitary). This is the time of the routes and city building.
In 1922, Palestine Electric Company is created. In 1924, the Technion Institute of Tecnology, in Haifa.
En 1932, the Habima Theater Company, in Tel Aviv.
1933, Bus Transport Cooperative Egged.
1934, Sieff (later Weizmann) Research Institute.
1936-9, Tel Aviv Port.
1936, Phylarmonic Orchestra.
1939, Hadassah Hospital.
So you see Israel was created by the jews way before the UN recognized it.
If you hadn't hear about all these, I'm sorry for all the propaganda you have to eat in your countries that prevented you to know the historical facts.
All of this, in the middle of actual pogroms, persecutions, living as a dhimmi in arab countries, and the Holocaust where ONE THIRD of the jewish population perished (including everyone in my family that stayed in Europe).
Compare that with arab palestinians: even after 60 years of whining for the Naqba, if they had invested 1% of the humongous foreign aid money (several times the Marshall Plan for Europe) to actually build a country instead of trying so hard to destroy the jewish one training their children as martyrs, they would totally have one country already and the UN bid would be a formality.
Yours truly,
H
PS: Full stop. :)
Yes, no doubt the Nazis worked real hard too, to build their Nazi state. As did the Apartheid South African Whites...
ReplyDeleteSo does that negate the human and legal rights of those whom they robbed and terrorized and murdered as a prerequisite for their racist states?
According to you, apparently, it does...
What I said does not deny the rights of anyone, including the palestinians, to have their rights or state. But it strongly refutes the dumb idea of "Israel was created by the UN" or "Israel was founded as an outpost of USA/USSR/Great Britain/etc in the Middle East", bla bla bla.
ReplyDeleteI wish palestinians get their country along Israel, not instead, soon, so please take what I mentioned above as suggested guidelines to build a state. You are welcome.
What country are you from, Alice? Are you a Sioux, Mayan or Inca native american?
Claims that the whole world has been brainwashed by false accusations against Jews tend to fall apart when one reads;
ReplyDeleteAcadia Yosef, a former chief rabbi of Israel said;
"Goyim [non-Jews] are like donkey's, born only to serve us.
http://jewishpeacenews.blogspot.com/2010/12/jonathan-cook-hate-gentile-israels.html
and as for refuting the allegation that Zionists are only interested in expanding Israel by any means, we have;
"In 1937, during earlier partition proposals, David Ben Gurion, a zionist, who was to become Israel’s first prime minister, wrote to his son,
“A partial Jewish state is not the end, but only the beginning. The establishment of such a Jewish State will serve as a means in our historical efforts to redeem the country in its entirety….We shall organize a modern defense force…and then I am certain that we will not be prevented from settling in other parts of the country, either by mutual agreement with our Arab neighbors or by some other means….We will expel the Arabs and take their places…with the force at our disposal.”
Quoted in Jerome Slater, “What Went Wrong? The Collapse of the Israeli-Palestinian Peace Process,” Political Science Quarterly, vol. 116, no. 2, 2001, pp. 173-74."
Ovadia (not Acadia) Yossef is an ass himself.
ReplyDeleteRegarding the other quote, I recommend you to read Ben Gurion byography to put it in context with his ideology.
H
i love egypt and i hope to it the best
ReplyDelete